The committee did not press him to either confirm or deny the details of the explosive testimony of Cassidy Hutchinson, the former White House aide who captivated the country late last month with her narrative of an out-of-control president willing to embrace violence and stop at nothing to stay in power, the people said. During a roughly eight-hour interview held behind closed doors at the O’Neill House office building, the panel covered some of the same ground it did during an informal interview with Mr. Cipollone in April. At Friday’s hearing, which took place only after Mr. Cipollone was served with a subpoena, investigators focused primarily on Mr. Cipollone’s views on the events of Jan. 6 and generally did not ask about his views on the testimony of other witnesses. A person familiar with Mr. Cipollone’s testimony said it provided new information that helped underscore the committee’s view that Mr. Trump had been abandoned in office on Jan. 6. Mr. Cipollone fought against the most extreme plans to subvert the 2020 election, according to multiple witnesses. Mr. Cipollone, who has long maintained that his direct conversations with Mr. Trump are protected by executive and attorney-client privilege, invoked certain privileges in refusing to answer some of the committee’s questions.
Key revelations from the January 6 hearings
The commission videotaped Mr. Cipollone with possible plans to use excerpts of his testimony in future hearings. Assistants have begun strategizing whether and where to adapt scripts to include key clips, one person said. The next hearing is scheduled for Tuesday. In the interview, Mr. Cipollone was asked about Mr. Trump’s false claims of a stolen election. The committee put similar questions to top Justice Department officials, White House lawyers and Trump campaign officials, who testified they disagreed with the effort to sway the 2020 election. Mr. Cipollone also traveled with Mr. Trump in response to questions about the former president’s pressure campaign against Mr. Pence, which included in-person meetings, a profane phone call and even a Twitter post attacking the vice president as rioters stormed the Capitol vowing to hang him, people familiar with the testimony said. Mr Cipollone’s agreement to be interviewed before the commission had prompted speculation that his testimony could either support or contradict the account of Ms Hutchinson, who made some of the most damning statements about his conduct. Mr. Trump to Mr. Cipollone. For example, she testified that Mr. Cipollone told her on the morning of Jan. 6 that Mr. Trump’s plan to escort the mob to Capitol Hill would force Trump officials to be “charged with every crime imaginable.” Two people with knowledge of Mr. Cipollone’s actions that day said he did not recall making that comment to Ms. Hutchinson. These people said the committee was told before the interview that Mr. Cipollone would not confirm that conversation if asked. He was not asked about that specific statement Friday, according to people familiar with the questions. “Why is Pat Cipollone and his lawyers letting the J6 Commission get away with Cassidy Hutchinson’s perjury?” Mr. Trump’s eldest son, Donald Trump Jr., who has also testified before the committee, tweeted on Saturday. “Only cowards let the Left bully them into sitting quietly instead of speaking up and telling the truth. Stop hiding in the background, Pat. Grow a spine and continue the file.” Mr. Cipollone was asked, however, about conversations in which presidential pardons were discussed. Ms. Hutchinson testified that on Jan. 7, the day after the Capitol attack, Mr. Trump wanted to pledge grace to those involved in the attack, but Mr. Cipollone argued that language making such a pledge be removed from the remarks which the president was going to deliver. He has also testified that members of Congress and others close to Mr. Trump sought pardons after the Jan. 6 violence. An adviser to Mr. Cipollone declined to comment on his appearance before the commission. “He was honest with the committee,” Rep. Zoe Lofgren, D-Calif., and a member of the committee, told CNN on Friday. “He was careful in his answers and I believe he was honest in his answers.” He added, “We got some additional insight into the actual day, January 6.” Ms Lofgren said Mr Cipollone did not contradict other witnesses. “There were things that he might not have been present for or in some cases he couldn’t remember accurately,” he said. Mr. Cipollone’s testimony came after he reached an agreement to testify before the commission, which had been pressing him for weeks to cooperate and issued a subpoena last month. Mr. Cipollone witnessed key moments in Mr. Trump’s push to overturn the election results, including discussions about sending bogus letters to state officials about voter fraud and seizing voting machines. He also had direct contact with Mr. Trump on Jan. 6, as rioters stormed the Capitol. Mr Trump has condemned Mr Cipollone’s cooperation. On Thursday, he posted on the social media platform Truth Social: “Why would a future President of the United States want to have frank and meaningful conversations with his White House adviser if he believed there was even a small possibility that this person, essentially acting as ‘lawyer’ for the Country, may some day be brought before a partisan and openly hostile Committee in Congress.’
